Topic: Compact tractor ballast
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| Cowlitz Tractor
09-25-2002 10:16:49
198.81.17.169
5260
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I deal in the compact tractors, and one of my greatest concerns is always hills and overloading the front loader, with my often "novice" tractor buyers. I always recommend my buyers have their tires filled with Antifreeze,,, and I turn the tires around to the widest position to offer stability. But for many of these people in my region, there are many hills, and this is sometimes not enough. But they are only managing 2-15 acres max. And a full size tractor is something they can't won't or don't concider. Nor is is economically feasible. So my queston to any of you out there,,,, is there any way to add 6 inches to each side of a compact tractors axles? For my hill maintaning clients I think it would be very beneficial. Especially in these little Yanmars! THey are only 38 inches wide when freight narrowed. I add 9 inches by turning the wheels, But that still seams awefully narrow! I sell all my little tractors with a tiller on them for counter balance, when using the loader. But I really feel being able to install longer axle shafts, or adding on to the exsisting shafts, (provided that would be strong enough) Would be a keen safety feature.
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| Upon much inner refelction...I feel the only answer is.....by Woodbeef
10-01-2002 04:50:14
207.164.209.39
5330
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Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to Cowlitz Tractor, 09-25-2002 10:16:49
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| | Now I realise this might not be what you want to hear,but......there is no safe,feasable way that you can do what you are asking on a CUT! They are great tractors for certain tasks,and have earned their place in manufacturers line-ups. But like everything else they do not work for anything&everything! Might want to look into O&V tractors. They are pretty much just utility tractors in a very small size. They have many of the same qualities and attributes of their larger brothers,so they can take more abuse,and duals,etc....
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| RickB.
10-01-2002 17:06:24
205.231.28.27
5338
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Re: Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to Upon much inner refelction...I feel the only answer is.....by Woodbeef, 10-01-2002 04:50:14
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| You lost me this time, WB! Explain how an O or V tractor which are both built to fit between narrow rows of trees/ grapes will fill the need for a tractor with a wider track/ lower center of gravity than a compact. Notice I didn't offer to keep them supplied with axle shafts and bearings after installing the spacers!
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| Woodbeef
10-02-2002 05:45:06
207.164.209.13
5343
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Re: Re: Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to RickB., 10-01-2002 17:06:24
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| | hey Rick, You might have missed out on a real gold mine there by not pitching your products!! Since O&V tractors are built for higher hp,and more severe duty vs a CUT they will have more inherent built in strenght. With this also comes heavier axle castings,axles,bearings,etc.... Which also translates into wider tires,duals,etc....,
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| RickB.
09-27-2002 15:03:22
205.231.148.5
5289
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Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to Cowlitz Tractor, 09-25-2002 10:16:49
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| Unverferth Corp out of Kalida, Ohio will build custom wheel spacers to do what you want. Many (most) farm equipment dealers have their catalog. They will need detailed info on what is to be built. Instructions for laying out custom jobs is in their product catalog. They do good work, and are cost competitive. I have no connection with them other than working at a dealership that sells their products when practical.
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| cowlitz tractor
09-27-2002 20:09:07
198.81.26.168
5294
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| Robert in W. Mi
09-25-2002 17:00:28
208.32.170.102
5272
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Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to Cowlitz Tractor, 09-25-2002 10:16:49
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| I'm sure you could get some "offset" wheels to widen it out, but you better order in a supply of axles to go with them!
I did have my little Kubota "dualed" in the rear for a few years, i guess that's another option.
Robert
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| What is your problem?
09-26-2002 20:35:39
216.98.174.205
5286
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Re: Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to Robert in W. Mi, 09-25-2002 17:00:28
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| Robert,
What is your problem with compacts? Yes, I know your have seen dozens of them broken, or was it hundreds? May be it was thousands! You always have a distorted answer for any one that has a question about compact tractors. If you had any thing to say that pertained to the questions asked it would be different but you never do. Why do you even say anything? Your more than likely just a weekend farmer with a big mouth, that has a BIG tractor that you don’t even really need. And speaking of big--when you post pictures, why don’t you learn how to post them so everyone doesn’t have to scroll right to left for the whole thread?
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| Hey, Mr. No Name,
09-27-2002 09:02:01
205.217.66.236
5287
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Re: Re: Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to What is your problem? , 09-26-2002 20:35:39
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| | I see you are pretty good at attacking me, but you don't even have b@11s enough to sign your real name. Why do you bother to OPEN any post you see my name on if you don't like my answers???????????? Actually i have over a dozen tractors on my farm, includeing a compact or two. I've also owned several other campacts over the years, and try to relate what i've learned with their use. The only thing you are right about is, i don't really need over a dozen tractors on my farn! I just like haveing them around! Even if i "never" owned any compacts, it doesn't take a genus to see all the problems owners of compacts are haveing when they use them for heavy duty use. Reading the "compact tractor owners board" alone will open your eyes, with owners baleing small squares and striping the PTO out of a Kubota, or a Boomer hauling loader bucket loads of dirt just to break the front wheel/houseing off. How about the tech. that related how he's replaced (2) rock shaft houseing on JD's that cracked!, because of carying heavy 3 point tools?? The list goes on, and on. When you read of these problems over and over, you'd be a fool not to pay attention. I have a tractor dealer friend who quit selling compacts because they were so lightly built! They had one or two come back with the front ends broke off!! They felt because they were in a farming community, and catered to farmers, they didn't want to sell such a light duty product. They do post here from time to time. My above post suggested the use of "off set wheels", and as i said, i had my Kubota compact "dualed" for a time. Isn't that answering the very question that was asked??? Compacts are very light duty, and i stand behind the opinion that when used for "real" farm duty, they BREAK! Widening the wheels can and does put a huge strain on the axles, so in my opinion if, as a dealer you are going to sell "widening kits" you should also expect to sell some axles and berrings! I've NEVER said compacts were junk. The problem comes in when owners try to make a "utility tractor" out of them!! Now tell me, what help did "YOU" offer to the origional question that will help the origional poster?????? Robert
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| Mr. No Name....
09-27-2002 15:38:06
216.98.174.63
5291
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to Hey, Mr. No Name,, 09-27-2002 09:02:01
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| | So Robert, we can add crude to your list of things that you are an expert on. This isn’t a locker room or a bar on the slum side of town. Yes, Robert, you have said in dozens of posts that all compact tractors are inferior. If not in exact words, in meaning in every post that you have replied to about compacts. From reading your posts even if a gentleman that had only 10 acres, that was like a golf course he would still need at least a 60-90 horse power tractor.
You mean to tell us that you have a couple of those inferior compact tractors on your farm? What do you use them for, field drags behind one of your big tractors. And now you also tell us that you were one of the very people that don’t know how to use equipment properly, example: putting duals on your compact. Yes, Robert there are broken parts on compacts but there are also broken parts on larger tractor, dozers and other equipment. On larger tractors, haven’t you every heard of a front axle yoke breaking or a axle breaking, or a spindle that broke, or a broke rockshaft or a pto shaft being stripped or being broke. If you say no to any of these, you haven’t been around tractors long enough to give an educated answer. I feel sorry for your friend. He is missing the boat. The largest selling segment in agriculture today is compact tractors. In fact, compacts are the only tractors that the number of units sold have increased in the last couple of years. Utility tractors and larger tractors volume units have decreased. What do you consenter real farm work? I bet that the large farmers in the Midwest, Florida, Montana, and California think that your utility tractors are not real tractors either. They would never think of taking your utility tractor to WORK in the morning. Their definition of real farm work, would not include your tractors. Everything or anything can be of the correct size and usage in its own scale of use. You don’t use a compact to farm 500 acres. You don’t use a utility to farm a 1000 acres. Every tractor size has it place. The correct size of tractor doesn’t mystically start a utility models nor does it stop there. No, I didn’t answer the original posters question. You did in your own way. But, there have been dozens of other posters and lookers that have received a distorted view on the usefulness and utility of compact tractors. And about reading your posts, they are just in the way of the truly useful information. By the way, what about the extra large jumbo pictures???? Try using a COMPACT picture on you next post……..
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| Mr. No Name....
09-27-2002 15:37:36
216.98.174.63
5290
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to Hey, Mr. No Name,, 09-27-2002 09:02:01
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| | So Robert, we can add crude to your list of things that you are an expert on. This isn’t a locker room or a bar on the slum side of town. Yes, Robert, you have said in dozens of posts that all compact tractors are inferior. If not in exact words, in meaning in every post that you have replied to about compacts. From reading your posts even if a gentleman that had only 10 acres, that was like a golf course he would still need at least a 60-90 horse power tractor.
You mean to tell us that you have a couple of those inferior compact tractors on your farm? What do you use them for, field drags behind one of your big tractors. And now you also tell us that you were one of the very people that don’t know how to use equipment properly, example: putting duals on your compact. Yes, Robert there are broken parts on compacts but there are also broken parts on larger tractor, dozers and other equipment. On larger tractors, haven’t you every heard of a front axle yoke breaking or a axle breaking, or a spindle that broke, or a broke rockshaft or a pto shaft being stripped or being broke. If you say no to any of these, you haven’t been around tractors long enough to give an educated answer. I feel sorry for your friend. He is missing the boat. The largest selling segment in agriculture today is compact tractors. In fact, compacts are the only tractors that the number of units sold have increased in the last couple of years. Utility tractors and larger tractors volume units have decreased. What do you consenter real farm work? I bet that the large farmers in the Midwest, Florida, Montana, and California think that your utility tractors are not real tractors either. They would never think of taking your utility tractor to WORK in the morning. Their definition of real farm work, would not include your tractors. Everything or anything can be of the correct size and usage in its own scale of use. You don’t use a compact to farm 500 acres. You don’t use a utility to farm a 1000 acres. Every tractor size has it place. The correct size of tractor doesn’t mystically start a utility models nor does it stop there. No, I didn’t answer the original posters question. You did in your own way. But, there have been dozens of other posters and lookers that have received a distorted view on the usefulness and utility of compact tractors. And about reading your posts, they are just in the way of the truly useful information. By the way, what about the extra large jumbo pictures???? Try using a COMPACT picture on you next post……..
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| Mr. No Name
09-28-2002 11:32:28
216.98.174.112
5301
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to Mr. No Name...., 09-27-2002 15:37:36
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| One more post.
Infering that compact tractors are inferior has been a standard theme in all of Roberts compact posts, this one was just getting started.
His pictures are great. They are the best part of his posts. The problem with the pictures are that the size is too large. When the picture is that large they cause the rest of the post to be to wide for the screen.
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| JK-NY
09-28-2002 06:42:21
209.240.198.63
5298
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to Mr. No Name...., 09-27-2002 15:37:36
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Points to consider-
1. Robert in W Mi offered an answer to the post- you didnt. So whose post is in the way of the useful info?
2. I didnt notice any negativity toward compacts to prompt this attack.(Or crudeness for that matter)
3.Many people have commented they enjoy the pictures Robert posts ,(me included). The suggestion to skip his posts if you see some thing that upsets you might be worth considering. I,m sure no offense was intended in the original post, all I noted was a brief answer to the orig. question
As to the original question- duals would add stability, also wider rims like used for turf tires. You would want to investigate availability of tire /rim combo's that would suit your customers needs, Also all the mentioned solutions will add considerable width, weight and stress to axles and final drive components. You would want to keep tis in mind. Also wheel weights may add weight that could help stability, although loaded tires lower the center of gravity of the tractor more. Good luck-JK
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| Cowlitz Tractor
10-01-2002 09:01:51
198.81.17.177
5333
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to JK-NY, 09-28-2002 06:42:21
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| Actually , today I am taking a Yanmar 1301 down to the tire shop, I'm having the rims changed to something a bit wider than factory, as well I'm having tires put on that are the low impression industrial, offering not only a lower profile, but stability through width. Albeit, I'm force to concider stress caused to the rear end by my changing the traction qualities. Just thinking of this in a physics fashion, I an thinking that the overall profile change may increase the rear end stress only marginally. The Ag lugs that are on it are rice patty tires, and I'm sure that those aren't with-out torque stressing qualities unto themselves. especially when turning.
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| THE Tractor Lady of Cowlitz Tractor
09-27-2002 20:35:59
198.81.26.168
5296
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to Mr. No Name...., 09-27-2002 15:37:36
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| WOW, did I kick over a bee hive in here. Hey all, I sell these compacts, I acually deal mostly in the grey markets! Now, don't get your breifs or boxers(what ever you wear) in a bunch ok... I have worked my butt off to insure I have consistant and regular parts for these. and have worked very hard to not only make myself reasonably knowledgible but reputable( I don't sell tractors I can't fix, get parts or manuals for). As women in this industry are rare, and useful ones even more so. Anyhow, the point I was attempting to get to is that in all of this I do have to agree that the CUT's are inferior when they are used in the wrong place or task. We've all heard the saying "horses for courses" Tractors apply there as well. They are lightly built, But they get into places the bigger stuff can't and are more often then not, much more affordable. But I caution anyone that thinks they are going to pull a self propelled baler and expect one of these little buggers to get it up then hill then God help them coming down. But in the same token, a big feild tractor wouldn't work for pulling a 48 in brush hog through most of our local tree farms. Subjective opinions are irrelevant, when it comes down to common sense. Common sense was for me to try to find new ideas to offer my customers, hoping to offer then greater safety, stablity, and mental comfort, BY asking people that might know more then me, or that had had more opprotunities to experiment on their own machines.
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| Crude......huh....what did I miss?......by Woodbeef
09-27-2002 16:10:52
207.164.209.50
5292
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to Mr. No Name...., 09-27-2002 15:37:36
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| | Yo Mr No Name,
Take it easy,eh! My good friend was only trying to point out that most people expect way too much out of those C.U.Ts!!
They might have the hp of older utility tractors,but they in no way have the weight or built in strenght of the older models!! As for Robert being crude......did I miss something? At least he has the cajones to post his name,and addy!!
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| em14
09-25-2002 16:32:17
209.251.151.228
5269
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Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to Cowlitz Tractor, 09-25-2002 10:16:49
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| | I agree that there needs to be away (and at a reasonable cost) to increase the width of the rear wheels on many of the small tractors ... not only when you are using the FEL but, perhaps even more important, is when a person is using a rotary mower/cutter ... this rotating mass tends to cause the tractor to become unstable when cutting a side hill such as a roadside off the shoulder ... I would think that, as on tractors that use spacers for spreading the duals, that you could do something like that. I guess that would then be an axle extention. The load on the axle bearings could cause early wear or even failure ... but ... if the tractor was designed knowing that condition is likely, then, there should be no problem...
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| Tractor Lady
09-25-2002 19:13:18
198.81.18.173
5273
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Re: Re: Compact tractor ballast in reply to em14, 09-25-2002 16:32:17
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| Agreed, fore thought on behalf of compact manufacturers would be wonderful, but I beleive that would be too much to ask. Nice idea though! So what can you tell me about extenders, or is this just a product many of us can only wish for but never actually find in the real world?
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